proportions

lalo's picture

I don't want to spoil the party or to be provocative but my questions is: have you ever met someone who upon being told that he is not the body or/and after practicing Self Enquiry, got enlightened?


tapas's picture

yes...it's not about being

yes...it's not about being told..but the conviction of it. totally believing. Instead of finding a flaw. if you are meditator, just try it wholeheartedly and you will find some truth. Just try to find the I. hahha...

tapas | Fri, 12/19/2008 - 05:24
Phroggy's picture

~

Can't say as I've ever heard such a thing happening. I see very clearly on an intuitive level and from a few different perspectives that there is no person here, and yet here I am still twidling my individual person thumbs with the rest of you persons. It does slow things down considerably and make ego sit in a corner pouting, so maybe we could say it's a good way to become 'accident prone'. There's a definite limit to what can be explored even intuitively and then there's nothing to do, which might make one more accident prone, but I wouldn't really know.

Phroggy | Fri, 12/19/2008 - 07:06
Omkaradatta's picture

Nothing to do...

This seems to relate to "knowing when to stop pushing the boat", and it seemed to 'work' just fine in my case. I dropped spirituality back in '03 altogether after five years of intense seeking, and fell immediately onto a path of aloneness + shedding all seeking, both spiritual and worldly. I never gave spirituality another thought after '03, at least until early this year when I returned to talk about stuff again.

There's really nothing to think about at all, it involves inner willingness or 'readiness' only.

http://www.omkaradatta.info

Omkaradatta | Fri, 12/19/2008 - 07:37
Phroggy's picture

~

There may be some clarity needed before the willingness and readiness happens.

Phroggy | Fri, 12/19/2008 - 08:59
Omkaradatta's picture

Oh sure...

In particular, clarity that a verbal focus (through words) isn't needed, and in fact may be something of a hindrance, as the mind probably has unnecessary beliefs/assumptions that need to be let go. Unfortunately, such clarity is hard to find using words/concepts to help look for it ;-).

http://www.omkaradatta.info

Omkaradatta | Fri, 12/19/2008 - 09:46
Phroggy's picture

Sure

Impossible to find through the words and concepts, and yet, these serve as a focus for intuition. If mind can avoid processing it and just 'look there', it may see something that hasn't been seen before. We've all actually done this, but we seldom recognize what occurred or how because mind/ego wants to take credit for figuring it out, while in reality it had nothing to do with it.

Phroggy | Sat, 12/20/2008 - 21:25
sisi's picture

This is a very good question

This is a very good question that should be heard, many of us in our desperate desire to have faith, unnoticeably repress these inconvenient doubts and so raising this question can only make our belief purer.

I am practicing Ramana's Self Enquiry for several years and in the first 2 years it was just spotting errors I (or rather the mind) do in the technique which is very delicate. It has made me much more aware and concious but not enlightened yet. I haven't met people who practiced SE and are enlightened but on the other hand I can say that most of them do not do it right - at some point they stick to some error and so from this point forward it ceases to be effective. In order to avoid some of the most common and misfortune pitfalls I recommend to read Self Enquiry - Tips.

sisi | Fri, 12/19/2008 - 14:08
arpgod's picture

Self Enquiry

Diac. In the West we tend to ask too many questions. Then we re question the answers and so on ad nauseam. In order to be enlightened we need to accept everything that (was) is and (shall be). So the question is "have you ever met anyone who accepted all that is?" My answer is Yes i have. I believe my Guruji is that.

arpgod | Tue, 01/20/2009 - 10:52
neo's picture

petitio principii

You are assuming a certain approach (acceptance of what is) as the sure path to enlightenment which may be true and may not, it is not equivalent nor a consequence of the question in the post.

I think the question in the post is a good one by itself, is direct and should not be avoided by placing other questions - let's be honest - many are on this path with a conscious or unconscious objective of some sort of realization.

According to my own experience and judgment meeting many teachers and sages on the road around the world over the years: the Advaitan turned to be too analytical and lazy at the end of the day (including the disciples of Nisargadatta Maharaj, Papaji, Ramana etc.) and the Zen people I have met turned to be too much into discipline, effort and inner conflicts. You can recognize the people belonging to these paths from distance. The people I can still say after a long time of acquaintance that if they are not enlightened then there is no enlightenment are one some sort of Sufi guy from Iran, one old yogi swamiji who lived not far from Haridwar 6 years ago, one which followed all paths and followed none whom I met the first time in an airport in USA waiting together for hours for a delayed shuttle flight, and yes, one Israeli Advaitan guy which I am not yet sure about him but he has these still pure qualities you learn to sense.

These four, needless to say, none of them are self appointed or self testified, none will ever talk about their state, they have a special vibe of complete stillness and egolessness around them and in what they do or write or say that you want to stay in their presence for ever. It is more the special spotless quality of their behavior than what they say, if they say something at all.

neo | Tue, 01/20/2009 - 16:02
mayasurfer's picture

Israeli advaita guy

the israeli advaita guy might well be Ameen. Well worth having a look at his website www.ameen.be

mayasurfer | Fri, 02/06/2009 - 06:48
solomon's picture

Regarding what?

Regarding what?

solomon | Fri, 02/06/2009 - 11:10
neo's picture

no

I don't remember his name but it is definitely not this one, he didn't see his spirituality as a profession, did not advertise himself nor collected any money.

Speaking of Israelis, there is also Shlomo Kalo but I think he is too old and does not meet people anymore.

neo | Fri, 02/06/2009 - 11:36
earthling's picture

Light within

:-) May b yourself
Metta ~ Peace & Light

earthling | Sun, 10/25/2009 - 12:15
carlito santo's picture

Do not give up

mmm you have a point!

But I learnt from experience that one should be persistent. It is very hard to eradict in one day accumulated conditioing over conditioing over dozens of years that say "you are the body".

Keep on the work.

carlito santo | Sun, 10/25/2009 - 15:58
Angelic1966's picture

SelfEnquiry is a dead end imho!

I practised it for years and it led me nowhere except to self denial/dissociation/suppression of life depression suicide and covert mind control by Ramana's autocratic spirit ( enlightened/no ego eh?!).

Imo the whole premise i.e.the annihilation of the ego is faulty..My own built-in inner guide/daemon showed me on the contrary that embracing the ego and aligning' it to & making it transparent to its source through Grace is much better gentler and wholesome...that's when the violent & sexually humiliating psychic attacks began from "Ramana the Angelhater"!!!

Advaita is nonsense when you think you are reading these words and you probably have to pay some bills tomorrow/take the kids to school etc...say Advaita really fast over and over and you get tada: advaita-dvaita-dvaita-dvaita = duality LOL
I'm so glad I got out of that trap alot of my health and creativity has returned but not without a struggle..
TODA ELOHOM OLAM AMIN .... ૐOM SRI VAC∞PARABRAHMA NAMAHA

Angelic1966 | Wed, 08/21/2013 - 21:24
Nathyogi's picture

Re: Proportions

It is easier said than done.
To bestow enlightenment on others was not in the hands of Ramana Maharshi for he claimed that he got it on its (not his) own. He was content with his experience and started sharing the same. He never searched for a Guru.
I read that he was asked by Lord Shiva to go to Arunachala to share and spread his experience with those who came to him. If this is true, he was a devotee of Lord Shiva.
Lord pleases if we serve His devotees and in turn our material wishes will be fulfilled.

Nathyogi | Thu, 07/31/2014 - 11:03