The Dog catching its tail

joejo's picture

Average: 5 (1 vote)

"A fresh restart to a brave new world", indeed a wonderful insight and I have nothing of value to add accept to say wow!. But I too want to discuss this point of hurt and sorrow as this may be one of the major issues in understanding of self.

We have seen this over and over again that more sensitive a person more he gets hurt and withdraws into a shell. All of us as a general rule are scared of hurt. Now naturally we build resistances and do not meet life fully. Therefore it is necessary to go into this mechanism of hurt.

We get hurt because our desires are frustrated, our hopes are dashed or we have a plan of what should be and things do not turn out that way. One of the major factors of hurt is the self-image. We go to any length to protect our image. Any hurt to this is more painful than the physical hurt.

Now any solution that does not alter this basic structure of brain will at best provide only temporary relief. So my suggestion is that we must do whatever is in our means to get a total insight into this.

Mind is the cause of the problem in the first place but as if by sleight of hand trick it at the next moment becomes a solution provider thereby prolonging this game of The Dog catching its tail.

nancy pro's picture

Brain, mind and all the rest

"Now any solution that does not alter this basic structure of brain will at best provide only temporary relief."

You assume that the spirit is a product of matter (brain) which is to say, in other words, there is no metaphysics, there is nothing besides what we perceive and understand. This is a tacit skeptical belief, just be aware of it.

"Mind is the cause of the problem in the first place"

How can a mind be a cause of a problem? It is just mind - a set of conditioning rules, impressions... The cause of the problem is the way we use the mind. As Eckhart Tolle says: the problem is actually that the mind uses us rather that we use it, it controls us, we are identified with it and from this all problem arises. Other than that, mind is an incerdible tool, isn't it?

nancy pro | Fri, 02/12/2010 - 18:42
joejo's picture

Is I different from mind?

Hi Nancy

There are two questions that have been raised by you. One is regarding spirit and matter and the other is if there is not something in us, the Ego, the doer who is different from the mind.

I shall take the second question first. Is the Ego, the doer separate from mind? Without going into what the Advaitic scriptures say about it, i shall try to explain the preposition that the mind and ego are co existential and one cannot exit without the other.

Whenever a thing exists in relation to the other it cannot be very different from it. For example my desire not to eat chocolate cannot be of a different level from the desire to eat chocolate and more so when it is a reaction to my eating chocolate. The effect cannot be essentially different from the cause.

Now let me ask you a fundamental question? Is the spirit or Atman or the Seer the doer? How did the desire to get rid of hurt arise. The entity that wanted to do away with hurt was not existing prior to the hurt. The I that wanted to change the feeling of hurt came up with the hurt and would disappear after the hurt was dissolved. Now you would say that there is something like the I existing even prior to the hurt. If it was so why did it not prevent the hurt, if it could do so afterwords. You would say it was ignorant earlier and with knowledge it will be able to succeed. Granted that even this is possible, though i doubt it because knowledge is rather the cause of hurt. In fact when we are hurt we get connected with all our past hurts. "My fate has been like this always", we are used to hear such complaints. Now even if it could succeed to get rid of hurt after knowledge, what is the guarantee that any further knowledge ( erroneous) will not make him a slave again. In this way there would be no hope of salvation ( release).

i am a student of Vedanta or Advaitic knowledge and do not deny the presence of Self or Spirit. But as to what its exact nature is and the philosophy of release from bondage have certain other views which we could discuss later. The non-dualists claim that there is nothing apart from spirit or Atman. It could equally be shown that there is nothing other than the matter (Gurdjieff ). An elaborate treatment of this theme could be kept for a separate discussion. For the moment i have just this to say regarding your first question.

joejo | Fri, 02/12/2010 - 23:49