deep sleep

drmithilesh's picture



Average: 4 (2 votes)

who sleep?our body with mind or we?why we feel fresh after adeep sleep?why we dont have memory loss after hours of deep sleep?



sisi's picture

A pure phisiological matter

i think the answers to these questions are purely pgisiological and no metaphisical conclusion can be derived from it. we sleep because our body and mind need it to recharge and to sort out matters that were supressed to the subconscious. But I don't see how we can conclude from this whether we are the body or not.

sisi | Mon, 04/19/2010 - 19:26
drmithilesh's picture

sleep

mk we need to be connected with a source of energy to recharge.this connection established during deepsleep perhaps

drmithilesh | Tue, 04/20/2010 - 16:33
drmithilesh's picture

subcouncious

where subconcious exist.

drmithilesh | Thu, 09/09/2010 - 14:53
mariposa's picture

What made you ask these

What made you ask these questions?

mariposa | Tue, 04/20/2010 - 13:48
drmithilesh's picture

mk freshness after deep

mk freshness after deep sleep.how it happens?it will never happens in sleep after pills oralcohol

drmithilesh | Tue, 04/20/2010 - 16:38
Shailendra's picture

who sleeps?

it is body with mind which sleeps because it tires and retires,not we. as a doctor you very well know the reason of attained freshness. as far as loss of memory is concerned it is not because when you switch off your computer hardware the memory stored in the software is never lost. mind is a software in the hardware brain. 'WE' never sleeps neither tires nor retires.

Shailendra | Sun, 09/05/2010 - 11:21
jasdir singh jaura's picture

"Mind" never sleeps,

"Mind" never sleeps, "Mind" keeps on running even during the sleeping mode of body, That is way one have dreams during sleeps,

Only our body takes rest during sleeping mode, As our mind is deeply attached with the sences of body so both our mind as well our body feels fresh after a deep & long sleep,

As Our "Mind" never sleeps, So there is a no place for loosing memory,

The sleeping mode of "Mind" is called "Awakened" in spirituality,

Sleeping of "Mind" means "Awakning" of "Soul",

"Spiritual" persons never sleeps,

The body of Spiritual person takes rest in "Samadhi" or in the other words we can say that "Normal person" cannot guess from the outside about "Spiritual person" weather he is sleeping or his "Soul" is not in the body,

jasdir singh jaura | Mon, 09/06/2010 - 08:11
santthosh kumaar's picture

If body is not the self then what is it that witnesses these thr

Deeper inquiry reveals the fact that, the self is not the body. If body is not the self then what is it that witnesses these three states without the body?

The dream is witnessed as a whole without the physical apparatus. Same way the waking experience also is witnessed by the same witness, which witnessed the dream as a whole.

The dream body and the dream world were within the dream. Same way the waking body and the waking world are within the waking experience. The formless witness which is aware of the three states, is within the three states, but it is without the three states.

It is within the three states, as their formless substance. It is without three states as their formless witness. The witness is apart from the three states, because it is formless, therefore it is not an entity or identity within the waking and dream.

The formless witness has to be grasped mentally to realize the fact that, the formless witness alone is real and eternal, and all the three states, which come and go, are mere mirage created out of the formless witness, which is in the form of consciousness.

Deeper analysis is very much necessary to understand and assimilate the Self-knowledge.

santthosh kumaar | Wed, 09/08/2010 - 17:11
jasdir singh jaura's picture

Can u write the wordings in Hindi,

Can u write the wordings in Hindi,

jasdir singh jaura | Thu, 09/09/2010 - 08:03
santthosh kumaar's picture

reply

Santthosh

Sorry, I am not good at writing in Hindi.

santthosh kumaar | Thu, 09/09/2010 - 10:43
jasdir singh jaura's picture

Witness,

Well it is practical cource through meditation,
Mare takings can never reach true spirituality,
Anyways,
"Soul" has two powers called "Surt" & "Nirt",

"Nirt" is the power of seeing,

"Surt" is the power of hearing,

Through meditation by collecting the full consiousness at the centre between both eyes the first power which appears is called "Nirt" (the power of seeing), it is also called opening of third eye, By concentrating more and more in the "Nirt" the second power which appers is called "Surt"(the power of hearing),

Than only one can understand the "True Witness",

This is also called the begining of Spiritual journey truely,

The place, The meditator reaches is discribed as:
"Trikuti" or "Sehas dal kaval" in hindus,
"Mukame allah" in Muslims,

It is the begaining of spiritual journey truely,
From here the spiritual journey starts truely,
There are still stages between compleate "Awaking" or "Enlightenment",

But mare takings can clear nothing, it is a practical cource,

Do and only do.

jasdir singh jaura | Sat, 09/11/2010 - 07:09
santthosh kumaar's picture

Knowledge of both matter and spirit is the True knowledge

Santthosh
People dip into meditation but they do not understand that that is only one half of the truth and that this dipping is also a mental discipline to for them to understand the true nature of the external universe, which understanding they must next get if they are to become Gnanis.

Thus in the Gita, Chap.XII Krishna tells Arjuna that knowledge of both matter and spirit is the True knowledge. One is living in the body, which is the world, and he has to eat and move and work in the external environment. One cannot get away from it. It is his life.

Therefore he ought to know, understand and grasp its meaning. A person who refuses to do so is refusing to face the whole of reality.

Sankara definitely says that Yoga is not the means of liberation [page 132-133 of his commentary on Brihadaranyakopanishad].

santthosh kumaar | Sat, 09/11/2010 - 09:09
jasdir singh jaura's picture

"Gita" was not dipped from the sky,

"Gita" was not dipped from the sky,
Somebody has written "Gita" with his true inner experience,
We cannot understand the language of our grandparents clearly properly & exactly,
So how can we make sure that we can understand the subjects in "Gita" which is 2000 yars old,
I respect "Gita", but it is not in the power of normal person to define or understand it,
Weather the truth is onehalf or full,
Every answer is within,
Ramyana was written by "Rishi Balmiki" 2000 years before it happens,
Yes Yoga is not the means of liberation, but the Question is: Why?
There is lot of difference between Bhakti & Yoya,
Anyhow,
goodbye.

jasdir singh jaura | Sat, 09/11/2010 - 09:36
santthosh kumaar's picture

The truth has to be proved without the scriptures

Santthosh

There is no need for scriptures in pursuit of truth. The truth has to be proved without the scriptures. Until we get rid of all accumulated knowledge based on the body as self, the ignorance bound to persist. Thus for the seekers of truth, it is necessary to drop all the accumulated baggage to understand,assimilate and realize the non-dual truth.

The religious truth and yogic truth are individual truth not universal. Non-dual truth is universal truth.

The Bhakti and yoga are meant for the worldly mass ,who believes the body as self. Because they are based on the false self, within the false experience. Whatever is based on the body as self is bound to be falsehood.

The one who has progressed in his pursuit of truth does not require religion,concept of god or scriptures or guru. He is fully aware of the fact that the self is not physical and he has learnt to view and judge the three states on the base of the true self ,which is consciousness.

On the base of consciousness[soul] as self the three states are impermanent and mere mirage. Thus the man and his experience of the world which is present only in waking is unreal, same way as the dream. The dream becomes unreal when waking takes place. The waking becomes unreal when wisdom dawns.

santthosh kumaar | Sat, 09/11/2010 - 11:05
jasdir singh jaura's picture

It is U who thinks that

It is U who thinks that The dream becomes unreal when waking takes place.

Every thing which we think during the daylight is Unreal,

Do u remember what was u thinking during the whole day yesterday, or the day before yesterday, each and every movement, not during the night, But when, U was waking in the day light, do u remember each and every movement, No!, That because, it was also the dream, that is why u don't remember each and every movement or thought clearly.

jasdir singh jaura | Sat, 09/11/2010 - 12:24
santthosh kumaar's picture

Consciousness alone exists because the unreal is created out of

Santthosh

Waking is parallel dream and dream is parallel waking experience. When the self is not physical what is it that witnessed the dream as a whole. The same witness witnessed the waking as a whole without the physical apparatus.

The self is neither the waking entity nor the dream entity, because it is formless and it is apart.

The waking entity and the waking world are within the waking experience, the dream entity and dream world are within the dream. The witness is the one sees the waking or dream as whole without the physical apparatus. In deep sleep it remains without the waking or dream.

The individual experience happening within the waking or dream is nothing to do with the self, because the self,which is consciousness pervades all the three states.

Thus limiting the self to waking entity[ego] and judging the truth is erroneous.

There is a need to analyze the three states, on the standpoint of the consciousness[soul] as self, to understand and assimilate what is real[soul] and what is unreal[mind]. And mentally drop the unreal by realizing the mind and soul are one in essence.

That essence is consciousness. Thus consciousness alone exists because the unreal is created out of consciousness,which is real and eternal.

There is a need to know what is mind and what is substance of the mind to unfold the mystery of the mind.

santthosh kumaar | Sat, 09/11/2010 - 16:24
jasdir singh jaura's picture

Do U Know!

Do u know!,
What is "Mind",
or
The Mystery,
or
The Subtance of what it is made,
or
The three states,
or
Who is the witness while analyzing the three states,

If No,
Than keep trying hard more than harder,
If Yes,
Than no need to comment further,
For Me, U r the "King" of Spirituality,
Respect U,
Goodbye.

jasdir singh jaura | Mon, 09/13/2010 - 07:02
drmithilesh's picture

geeta

we canot read geeta without wishes of shri krishna.what is nessesary for us, to do HIS work in this world, is only thing which we understand out of it.so the more than thausands of its different translations are available.no two person can understand same .differant people differant views .jai shri krishna(jsk0

drmithilesh | Sun, 09/12/2010 - 06:09
Shailendra's picture

Body mind and dreams.

As mind is attached to the ( five ) senses which are part of this gross body, always and only exposed to the gross world; goes on rest with the body in sleep. However 'mind' along with 'intellect' and 'ego' (man, buddhi and ahankar) are part of the subtle body known as 'ANTAHKARAN' are again interrelated with gross body. So in any case it is not mind which holds memory of dreams. The whole of the game is played in the field of consciousness. The individual consciousness (vyasti chetna) which is an indifferent part of the universal consciousness (samasti chetna) and which has several layers like conscious, subconscious, unconscious are always at work independent of different body conditions. Mind basicaly acts at the superficial level which is just tip of the iceberg (consciousness). In sleep when mind and body go into rest the thoughts lying in the deeper layers of consciousness starts erupting- the dream, witnessed by the same witness who is eternaly present, neither tires nor retires. It is ever awake in all the three stages (jagrat,swapna and susupti). It is hs who remembers the dream.

Shailendra | Thu, 09/09/2010 - 09:20
santthosh kumaar's picture

Illusion is that which appears as waking or dream and disappears

Santthosh

The meaning of "Immortality is not physically living, but knowing the immortal self, which is the consciousness [soul], is our true identity." If one has to live perpetually he would eventually lament his lot amidst the troubles, terrorism, calamities of life, and pray for death to come: one will never find enduring satisfaction in any form of existence unless one knows the truth of life and of the nature of life.

When one observes deeply the plants, he finds it rejects oxygen he accepts and takes only the carbon which he rejects. Thus part of him passes into the plant. One eats plants and the latter passes into him. Thus one and the same substance circulates in different bodies or forms. It is impossible to say what his-self is and what is not, when everything is self, which is the consciousness.

One cannot say that nothing exists; merely because he says all is illusion. But the fact is non-existence cannot be understood without knowing the meaning of existence. It is impossible to say anything of non-existence and use meaning as well as sound.

One can only say a thing does not exist there or here. While one is actually seeing the world, it would be madness to deny its existence. Illusion does not mean that. One see change, i.e. ideas come and go; experience shows that one thing changes into another, only ignorant people say that anything can become non-existent; so the whole world must remain existent in some way or other and cannot totally disappear.

The insoluble gap which exists for science between the physical sensation and mental awareness of it disappears for the Gnani because on inquiry he finds that they never saw a physical sensation, it was really a mental sensation.

Nobody has any experience nor is there any illustration in this universe that the mortal ever becomes immortal. In pursuit of truth one has to adhere to common experience only. How can one understand the meaning of death unless he takes something in this universe! One has never seen the invisible consciousness[ soul]. All he can say is that he has seen mortality of everything in this world because everything is mortal and remains so. Take anything: it is subject to change and destruction. It cannot be shown that any object has changed its nature, once one really knows the nature of things. Nothing has really been changed.

The world scene is constantly changing. The stars, moon and everything changes. Because of ignorance one is not aware of the fact that, he and his experience of the world can exist only in waking/dream. The waking/dream come and goes, therefore they are impermanent in their nature. Thus contents of the waking/dream have to be impermanent in their nature.

What is the meaning of this change? People ignorantly attribute mysterious power to illusion, but it is simply change in its true meaning. Illusion is that which appears as waking or dream and disappears as deep sleep.

People accept the fading of a flower without inquiry: only when he asks what has become of its vanished color he is asking the meaning of illusion. Where is the color which has faded from the flowers? Similarly with waking/dream experiences? Where is it is deep sleep or after death? This is the question of illusion.

If one says God has taken the dead, then he must show them as with Him. Who has seen that? Therefore it is a lie to say so: one must be truthful is a first condition in pursuit of truth, and not tell lies or imaginings which are the same as lies. Only when non dual wisdom dawns then one becomes aware what illusion is, where waking/dream experience go and what becomes of them.

santthosh kumaar | Thu, 09/09/2010 - 10:52
santthosh kumaar's picture

Santthosh If self is not

Santthosh
If self is not the form then self has to formless, on the base of formless self , where is the body? where are the senses? Where is the ego?Where is the universe?

Everything exists as reality only when the body is considered as self.

Deeper inquiry reveals the fact that, neither the body nor the ego is the self. Therefore, when the body/ego is not the self then viewing and judging the worldview on the base of body as self is the cause of ignorance.

One has to get rid of the ignorance by tracing and realizing the formless witness of the three states,to be the true self. Then only it is possible to become aware of the fact that, the formless witness alone is real and eternal, and the three states are mere myth.

santthosh kumaar | Thu, 09/09/2010 - 11:28
Shailendra's picture

real or false !

When a story teller makes a story he creates time (period) space (place) and characters of different unique individuality and personality. They appear to be so real that the reader laughs and cries with them though they only exist in the mind of the writter. Likewise we all (the whole of universe) exists in the consciousness of 'SOMEONE'. Imagine this is real or false ?

Shailendra | Thu, 09/09/2010 - 16:17
drmithilesh's picture

TRUE

IN BHAGWAT GEETA ch 9, 6 HE says the same thing and its true

drmithilesh | Thu, 09/09/2010 - 16:39
santthosh kumaar's picture

there is no second thing exists other than consciousness because

Santthosh
In the realm of truth, there is neither creation nor creator, and then the form, time and space are mere illusion created out of consciousness. The consciousness alone is real and eternal, all else is mere mirage created out of consciousness. Therefore, there is no second thing exists other than consciousness because everything is consciousness.

santthosh kumaar | Fri, 09/10/2010 - 00:47
drmithilesh's picture

formless witness

formless witness is always present .we can't realise HIM. But when we come out of our sense organs ;we are with HIM.it really happens in deep sleep and so freshness happens.-----------------`Similer phenomenon happens with samadhi or in deep bhacti.so these are the true paths .samadhi is union with universal formless conciousness and bhacti is living in with HIM (KRISHNA))

drmithilesh | Thu, 09/09/2010 - 16:28
santthosh kumaar's picture

The one which witnesses the pain and pleasure is not the body

Santthosh
The one which witnesses the pain and pleasure is not the body. The body ,which is born,lives and dies within the world is not the witness.

The witness is the one ,which witnesses the body and the world together without the physical apparatus . Until we think the body as self, the universe ,which contains all of us will prevail as reality.

When we become aware of the fact that, the self is not physical but the self is Atman, then only we become aware of the fact that, our true identity is without the body and the world.

Thus our true focus of attention should be on the Atman, not on the imaginary gods. because Atman itself is Brahman or ultimate truth. Ultimate truth itself is God/Christ/Buddha.

When we become aware of our formless true identity then the burden and bondage experienced within the world as an individual, is mere mirage created out of Atman ,which is in the form of consciousness.

santthosh kumaar | Fri, 09/10/2010 - 01:22
drmithilesh's picture

formless witness

formless witness is always present .we can't realise HIM. But when we come out of our sense organs ;we are with HIM.it really happens in deep sleep and so freshness happens.-----------------`Similer phenomenon happens with samadhi or in deep bhacti.so these are the true paths .samadhi is union with universal formless conciousness and bhacti is living in with HIM (KRISHNA))

drmithilesh | Thu, 09/09/2010 - 16:28
santthosh kumaar's picture

Krishna [consciousness/Brahman] alone is

Santthosh

Brahman is considered the all-pervading consciousness, which is the basis of all the animate and inanimate entities and material. (brahmano hi pratisthaham, Bhagavad Gita 14.27)

If one considers Krishna as Brahman [ultimate truth] then only there is unity in diversity. If Bhakti is limited to the belief of Krishna or Chirst, then it leads to hallucination. If formless witness is ever present then that itself is Krishna/Christ/Buddha/Allah. Therefore, realizing the formless witness [Brahman or Krishna or Chirst] as self is Self-Realization.

The beliefs of god, religion, yoga are based on the false self; therefore they are nothing to do with the mental [inner] journey. The religious, rituals, worships, devotion prayers god and guru glorification may be useful in the worldly life, for those who believes in the birth, life, death and the world as reality, but they are not useful tools in realizing the ultimate truth. Because the body is not the self, therefore, the experience of birth, life, death and world are mere illusion created out of Ataman, which is Brahman.

Only in waking we are aware of the deep sleep experience. In waking we are unaware of the nature of the true self [Brahman]. Consciously becoming aware of the true self [Brahman] in the midst of the waking experience and realize all the three states are myth, is self-realization or truth realization. Yogic Samadhi and deep sleep are identical; they have no value in realm of truth.

On the base of consciousness [soul] as self, everything other than the consciousness is mere mirage. Thus, body, senses, ego, and the world and his belief of god and religion are part and parcel of the mirage created out of consciousness.

Gaudapada says that:- The merciful Veda teaches karma and Upaasana to people of lower and middling intellect, while Jnana[wisdom] is taught to those of higher intellect.
This clearly indicates that religion, which is based on individual conduct, prescribes karma and Upaasana to people of lower and middling intellect, therefore religion is for the lower intellect.

And wisdom is for those are capable of inquiring into their own existence to know and realize the ultimate truth, which is Brahman.

Therefore, if one is seeking truth he has to know his true self is not physical but it is the Ataman, which is in the form of consciousness.

Self-knowledge cannot be attained by study of the Vedas and intellectual understanding or by bookish knowledge. Therefore there is no use of studying the Vedas and other scriptures like Bhagavad-Gita, Bible or holy Koran, in order to acquire the non-dual wisdom.

That is why Buddha rejected the scriptures, and even Sri, Sankara indicated that, the ultimate truth lies beyond religion, concept of god and scriptures.

Living with Krishna means, living in duality. Living in Duality means, living in ignorance. Living in ignorance means, living in illusion. Living in illusion means, experiencing the duality as reality. The duality is mere illusion the standpoint of the soul, which is the true self. Thus living itself is mere illusion. If living illusion then the birth, life, death and world are also is mere illusion.

When everything is created out of Krishna [soul], then nothing exist, other than Krishna [soul] which is in the form of consciousness. Krishna [consciousness/Brahman] alone is, all else [body, ego, senses, world] are mere illusion.

santthosh kumaar | Fri, 09/10/2010 - 00:36
drmithilesh's picture

atman, brahman

self realisation is the station from where journey starts.budha was avtara(formless universal infinite counciousness take birth to teach us how to live in HIS world).his followers misunderstood him and instead of doing his vakti ,they said that they are atman not less than bhagwan budha.its a normal human ego.total surrender to bhagwan budha will make you happy and contended.

drmithilesh | Fri, 09/10/2010 - 16:48
santthosh kumaar's picture

Duality is falsehood.

Santthosh
Sirji,
Thank your advise.

When the self is realized, then where is the station, where is the universe, where are names and forms, where is the ego, where is the body, where are the avatars. When all is one, then who has to surrender to whom. To surrender means there is duality. Duality means a second thing. Duality is falsehood.

On the base of true self [consciousness] the birth, life, death and universe are mere mirage. The pain and pleasure are part of the mirage. In Spiritual sense Buddha /Christ/Brahman means ultimate truth or consciousness. Know the ultimate truth and that truth sets one free from experiencing the illusion as reality.

santthosh kumaar | Fri, 09/10/2010 - 23:15
santthosh kumaar's picture

Duality is falsehood.

Santthosh
Sirji,
Thank you for your advise.

When the self is realized, then where is the station, where is the universe, where are names and forms, where is the ego, where is the body, where are the avatars and gods. When all is one then who has to surrender to whom. To surrender means there is duality. Duality means a second thing. Duality is falsehood.

On the base of true self [consciousness or soul] the birth, life, death and universe are mere mirage. The pain and pleasure are part of the mirage. In Spiritual sense Buddha /Christ/Brahman means ultimate truth or consciousness. Know the ultimate truth and that truth sets one free from experiencing the illusion as reality.

santthosh kumaar | Fri, 09/10/2010 - 23:20
Shailendra's picture

Dvait and Advait

Debate over dvait and advait is age old and untesolved. There are different school of hindu philosophy like Dvait, Advait, Advaitadvait, Vishishtadvait etc with their respective thoughts about 'jiva', 'jagat' Braham', 'Ishwar', 'Aatma', 'Parmatma'. The dezte is endless and followers of a certain school keep firm belief in theire understanding of the matter. Here emerges religion/sects which takes a person away from spirituality. 'THAT' which is allpervading omnipotent, omniscient, omnipresent ; by dint of which this universe seems to exist is formless but has it not all the capacity to take form if it wishes so? And what authority we have got to accept or reject it? As far as realization is concerned can a drop realize the ocean? Maximum a drop can do is to sublimate itself into the vastness of the ocean and only by becoming an ocean it can realize its truth. All the tools for realization available with a human being have its limitations and that 'supremo' is beyond the limits. By the way dear mk, in case of Budha you must be knowing that there are mainly three sects in Budha followers namely 'mahayaan', 'Vajrayaan', 'Hinyaan' out of which mahayaan and vajrayaan both do worship Budh idol with all the rituals inspite of the fact that Budhha himself was a strong opponent of idol worship. It was Budha teaching that ' kill the Budha '. He used to say that he was not the first or the last Budha. 'Aapo dipo bhava' was his blessings. However, Budha is a different school which comes under three nastik schools of hindu philosophy. Dont try to drag or compare it with aastik school of philosophy; you are follower of which!

Shailendra | Sat, 09/11/2010 - 11:34
santthosh kumaar's picture

Know the truth and that truth sets him free from ignorance.

Santthosh
I am the follower of truth. Some philosophy are nearer to truth but not truth in itself. There is no need to follow any path or any guru or cult, one has to be on his own and know the truth and that truth sets him free from ignorance.

Thank you for interacting.

santthosh kumaar | Sat, 09/11/2010 - 16:45
drmithilesh's picture

.need not to read

theoraticlly you are wrong.then how i can say to experiance it.be your sirjee yourself and then realise .we are not almighty ,are you? you may be .HEis nirgun nirakar we are sagun nirakar.HE is our master ,our father ,teacher ,mother .we are inside HIM but HE is not inside us.HE is like flower and its frgrance is like counciousness which we idivisualy expiriance ,and everyidividual experianc is same.that fragrence is like atman which is inside us and also outside.but we neither becom flower nor can emmit its fragrence.dont escape by short cuts.

drmithilesh | Sun, 09/12/2010 - 17:38
santthosh kumaar's picture

Santthosh When you and your

Santthosh

When you and your experience of the world is myth, then who is there to experience it. Only when one understands the fact that, body and the universe are created out of single material[consciousness] then only there is unity in diversity. There is neither the experience not the experiencer in non-dual reality.

When one does not know what is untruth how can he know what is truth. Thus it is erroneous to pass judgment on others who is right and who is wrong in pursuit of truth. Seeker has to verify whether he is right or he is wrong.
It is very difficult to grasp the non-dual truth with all your accumulated baggage, which leads you no where.

Thank you
No more discussion.

santthosh kumaar | Sun, 09/12/2010 - 18:06